I write this post after reading another post by a green button member who is disillusioned by media centre and is giving up on it and using a STB box instead. 

Media Centre, when it works, is the best most complete feature-rich HTPC software out there. It has a great 'professionally-built' look and provides a platform for developers to expand its capabilities. It really is a great product, and nothing else out there even comes close, when it works! The thing is, anyone who is actually reading these forums is probably computer-literate enough to fix the small problems and cope with the unreliability that media centre throws up. They probably don't even notice themselves fixing small issues with MCE because its become second-hat to them now. We love media centre, so we put up with its issues for this reason. Now go and setup up a media centre setup for a family member or friend and see if you can get past 6 months without them phoning you for help.

I've made this mistake. My brother used mine and instantly wanted it. I set it up for him and now I get constant phone calls. The TV tuner isnt working, recorded tv recorded the wrong thing, how do I rip movies etc. All these queries are easily answered by me and probably everyone reading this. But my brother doesn't expect to have these problems. You dont have them with SKY+ or Virgin Media (I'm UK based). So why with MCE?

At the end of the day media centre, at it's core, is a PC. Which defently has its advantages, it makes the platform very flexible, you can expand its capabilities with third-party applciations, something you can't do with consumer electronic based solutions. But then CE-based products have what 95% of the public actually want, something that just works. Face it guys, you're reading a forum dedicated to a microsoft software product, you're all geeks!! You probably like fixing problems within media centre and get a self-satisfying warm feeling inside from doing so (I know I do), but as other members to this website have said, people have had enough of there wife's calling them when they're out to ask them why something isnt work. Media centre, for all it's brilliance, just isnt ready for prime time just yet.

Hopefully in the future MS could make a more CE based product, maybe something like the AppleTV (btw, I am NOT an apple fan boy before anyone tries to jump on me). AppleTV runs a cut-down version of OSX and does only what it has to do. Maybe MS could do this with Media Centre. Create a new dedicated OS which is a streamlined and effecient version of Win7. Something that just runs the bare essentials needed by the media centre application without all the bloatware. I'm expecting certain replies to this post. I know you can dive into system management and disable certain services which aren't needed, I also know you can change the shell from explorer.exe to ehome.exe, but come on guys, you know what I'm saying. The normal consumer wont do this stuff.

How about dedicated home theater PCs with a dedicated Media Centre OS which is fine-tuned for HTPC use. 'Windows 7 Media Centre Edition' (or something). Linux has a distro called 'Mythbuntu', Apple has 'AppleTV', come on Microsoft. I think Media Centre should stay as an application within Windows 7 aswell, for students etc who use media centre casually, but I'd love to see a dedicated OS for us enthusiasts and the 'non-computer-literate' Joe Public.

Thanks for reading.

Wesley.

I think a dedicated WIn 7 Media Centre version would be a great idea.  My current HTPC is only used for that purpose and to serve content to extenders.  My current HTPC causes me grieve, and the family wants me to shut it down because it takes too much maintenence and support.  Everyone who sees it loves it, but I could never recommend it because of the overhead it requires.  Thus, my HTPC will be shut down in the near future and I'll look for alternatives (such as Apple TV or other Media Players that just grab content).  TV on the HTPC (e.g. HD) is such a huge pain that I will go the STB route.  Simplicity and ease of use/maintenence is key.  I don't want to have to be a nerd to use technology like this.

I agree with the dedicated MC OS, or an option when Windows is installed to dedicate the install as an MC machine and dummies down the OS accordingly.

mcewinter:

I agree with the dedicated MC OS, or an option when Windows is installed to dedicate the install as an MC machine and dummies down the OS accordingly.

I'm going to agree too. It would be nice to have a version with less resources but, I can see problems with some applications that need windows services to run correctly for Media Center (like PowerDVD and some other apps).

The biggest thing for me why I would want a Media Center Edition is the timeline. Media Center major updates are limited to the Windows release schedule, if MC had it's own version of windows, it's possable things like blu-ray could come sooner than Windows 8......

I totally agree. Microsoft seperated the 'Mail' and 'Movie Maker' applications into the 'Windows Live Essentials' suite. Making them a seperate download makes them more maintainable and upgradable by Microsoft. MS should follow this strategy more with the Media Centre ecosystem. Media Cente needs to be updated more then Windows as a whole does.

And come on Microsoft, if even Toshiba (HD-DVD pioneers) are licking there wounds and now producing Blu-Ray players, it's time for you to step up to the play, and make Blu-Ray playback a standard within MC.

Of course there would still be the need for some basic Windows functionality, even perhaps all of it.  I would be content with the option upon installation what type of application the machine will be used for - Standard or MC.  Standard would install windows business as usual and MC would gear the machine for entertainment maybe with its own minimum sytem requirements scrutinized for an ideal MC experience.

If MC was marketed as an MC OS then the revenue could be delegated back into MC development.  The risk would be that we truly are such a small crowd that MC would suffocate from a lack of funds.

I fear MC won't be set it and forget until formats/codecs in general find a standard(?). I wonder when all of the Mac drones will realize that their trapped inside of itunes.  The problem is that they don't care, they love it for some reason, as we do Media Center.  Although, all that Apple needs to do now is offer TV support and the Apple buddies will eat it up and give it rave reviews.

It's hard enough as a user keeping up with this crap sometimes, it must be living hell for those who have to make it work, just so I can use it.  Regardless, it would be nice to see the push for Media Center that a lot of us have been talking about for so long with the advent of Windows 7.

The Ceton tuners will offer a significant change that the MC world really needs, but we really need to see more devices with functionality that we've been craving, like extenders that actually emulate MC.  The fact that we have companies out there like the Ceton crew and Silicondust, who actually have contact with the little people (us) standing behind their product then us DIYers have a hobby with a future.  Anybody just getting into MC is starting at a good time IMO, six months from now (approx.) might be better but it's never to early to get your hands dirty.  It's not without it's bugs but I feel we're a long way from MCE 2005.

A CE based Windows 7 Media Center Edition device would only be half of the equation, it also needs a support organization behind it. Think about it. Say you get a multi-room DVR from Verizon. Initially, a technician will come out and install it for you. If anything breaks, you call Verizon and another technician will come out and fix it. With Media Center, unless you hired a custom integrator, who do you call? Microsoft is in the business of building platforms and then let OEMs, system builders and even enthusiast handle the rest. If you buy a PC, who handles the support? It's the OEM. Microsoft already has a CE level media platform. It's called MediaRoom and it's used by AT&T and other mostly European providers for their IPTV solutions. You can't walk into Best Buy and buy a MediaRoom device. You can only get it through your provider. They will install and support it for you. It is always been my argument that unless cable providers start selling Media Center solutions it won't break into the mainstream consumer market. Much of this is about who can you call if things don't work.

Something else that just occurred to me. Did you realize that you are essentially asking for a Tivo that runs Windows 7 and Media Center at the core instead of the Linux based OS that Tivo is running? Now, Tivos aren't exactly flying off the shelfs, either. Tivo did ok when DirecTV was OEMing their software. Most of their subscribers were DirecTV customers. Once that relationship fell apart, they went through a rough patch and realized they have to cut OEM deals again with cable providers. As far as I can see, standalone Tivos aren't bought by your average consumer. This goes back to my previous point. Standalone DVR solutions are a though sell unless your distribution channel is through the cable/satellite providers.

Oh, I realize that you are living in the UK, so you might not be familiar with Tivo. My point I guess is that a standalone CE DVR has been tried in the US market and the success has been marginal. Tivo today has many of the features Media Center has and some that Media Center still doesn't have and the UI has long been a benchmark. One other difficulty that has to be considered outside of the US is that most digital cable systems are completely closed down. At least here in the US we have CableCARD. While it's far from the perfect solution, it's a lot better than not being able to connect third-party devices at all.

Hi and thanks to all those who replied. Some very good points have been raised that I overlooked.

First I'd like to reply to 'mcewinter'. An option during instalation, in my opinion, would be a very good answer. If you pick the Media Centre option then setup could change settings, load only need services and apps, and customise and streamline the OS for a more 'appliance' like expereince. I personally have MCE PCs that I dont use for any other computer tasks except for the MCE functionality, so this would be a very good compromise for me. And as for 'Mac Drones', haha, that made me laugh. You're so right. AppleTV, for all of it's simplicity, is a joke. Only the 'Mac Boys' would accept 5 out of 6 main menu options pointing them to the iTunes store. [update: Apple have just released an update the Apple TV called 3.0 which changes the main menu and now the default options point to your own content (About time)]. I don't think this is the direction that Microsoft should be heading at all. Media Centre is defintly getting more reliable and a much better product, you're right, we're a long way from MCE 2005. The whole ecosystem has expanded and hopefully will keep on gaining momentum and gain partners and support that will beefit us all.

And to 'Superswiss'. You made good points about where the support comes from. You're absoluetly right, MS are a platforms company, and as a result, do not provide end-user support, the OEMs do. Maybe we do need more companies that produce the hardware that this new streamlined OS could run on. I know over the pond you have companies such as S1 Digital and Niveus Media doing some great work on the Media Centre platform, but you pay a massive premium for there hardware and support. I think the answer lays half way. A CE-based DVR running Windows wasn't really what I was getting at. A software based solution would be more viable and flexible, seems as many of us have different needs and wants in our setups. A 'Media Centre' type setup option during Windows setup would provide us DIYer's and system integrators a way to provide the end-user, if that be a customer or a friend or family member, a better and more reliable experience.

Whatever the solution, for Media Centre to gain mainstream acceptance, it has to be more robust and reliable. I personally love it but when people ask me to install one for them, I always try to avoid doing it, simply because of the overhead and (free) support you have to provide afterwards. It defintly has come a long way though and I'm sure it will eventually get there.

I'm trying to wrap my head around this. For TV, DVD, Music and Pictures, Media Center is a set-up and forget proposition. For the most part so is setting up powerdvd for blu-ray. Once you enter the realm of ripping DVD's etc, you leave the realm of general consumer and enter the enthusiast arena.

We have all the problems that come along with customizing media center because we, well, customize media center.

Let me throw a car analogy in - If I was a rally car driver and brought a friend along on a blazing trip through the snow, sure they'd think it's cool and would want to be able to do the same thing. If they don't learn how to modify a car and how to control it, they'd better not call me when they wrap the family minivan around a tree.

If they want it to do ALL of the cool things my MC can do, they had better bloody well learn what it takes to maintain it.

netscan02:

I'm trying to wrap my head around this. For TV, DVD, Music and Pictures, Media Center is a set-up and forget proposition. For the most part so is setting up powerdvd for blu-ray. Once you enter the realm of ripping DVD's etc, you leave the realm of general consumer and enter the enthusiast arena.

We have all the problems that come along with customizing media center because we, well, customize media center.

Let me throw a car analogy in - If I was a rally car driver and brought a friend along on a blazing trip through the snow, sure they'd think it's cool and would want to be able to do the same thing. If they don't learn how to modify a car and how to control it, they'd better not call me when they wrap the family minivan around a tree.

If they want it to do ALL of the cool things my MC can do, they had better bloody well learn what it takes to maintain it.

What your saying is true to an extent, if you play by the rules, everything should be pretty straight forward.  However watching the TV that I subscribe to on a "DVR" shouldn't be considered a modification,  programming QAM channels isn't really a modification, but you can't hand an MC machine to Uncle Roy and expect him to set it up and enjoy it without incedent.  Trust me, he'll call you with a question or ten.

As for your car analogy - I'm sure it's happened. 

I think you took one tiny comment I mentioned about DVD ripping and took everyone elses comment wrong and used it to have an unnecessary rant! Really? Is that how you read these posts? You're telling me that people who don't customise Media Centre don't have problems. There's thousands of posts on 'The Green Button' having problems with TV, DVD, Music, Pictures and Blu-Ray, the things you say are "set-up and forget propositions". I wish I could "set-up and forget", the truth is, the majority never do!

I didn't take any of this as a rant! Hell, the only reason i even read this post is probably the same reason everyone else has. There are many people who love MC, and most of us come to TGB to share our expiriences with it to others. I certainly agree the MC has its problems, but i believe that most people (who even discover it in the first place!)   - 1) set it up, 2) love it, 3) run into a problem, 4) try to fix it, 5) GIVE UP, and leave MC alone forever! ----------------- OR become an enthusiast that is willing (and almost crack-head like wanting!) to dedicate the time to having a FAR superior media experince! 

I agree!

kingpinjimi:

(and almost crack-head like wanting!)

I defently agree! ha